Addiction and Healthy Communication: How We Can Build Stronger Relationships in Recovery

SPEAKER_03 0:00
Well if we all communicated so well, why is there so much that the other person doesn’t know about us?

SPEAKER_04 0:05
If you said something and even if I didn’t like or agree with what you said, I’d be like, okay. But whenever we do, you know, talk about this in an aggressive way, it’s me saying, Well, I don’t really care that you want to eat healthy. If you want to hang out with me, we’re gonna go get donuts.

SPEAKER_03 0:19
I did talk about needing to lose weight or I needing to get into the gym and you know taking better care of myself. So there’s truth in that, and I want everybody to make sure you’re hearing that. It’s we’re trying to get the truth out.

SPEAKER_04 0:30
And we’re back. It’s Lainey and Natasha. And we are with Impact Wellness Network, and we are just hoping to bring you all some community and support and education um wherever you are. Um, and so whenever you are ready to reach out to us to get further support, we will always be here in your ears, in your car, wherever.

SPEAKER_03 0:48
Wherever you want to have us.

SPEAKER_04 0:50
People always used to say they wish they could put, you know, Elaine and Tasha in their pocket. Uh huh. Now we can be in your pocket. We can be in your car, we can be in your ears. Yeah. I was gonna say you’re welcome, but some people might be like, uh, I don’t think I really wanted that. Um that’s all right. That’s all right. Um, maybe you just didn’t communicate it very effectively. Um I like that segue. I caught you off guard with that one. Uh so what we’re gonna talk about today is communication. Um, and I, you know, here’s something that I want to say. I think I’m oblivious to what good communication is. And let me explain that. I oftentimes have asked people, you know, what’s your communication like? Do you communicate well? And so many people tell me they do. And I’m thinking to myself, well, if we all communicated so well, why is there so much that the other person doesn’t know about us? Am I wrong? No, you know, I’m wrong. It’s a great, it’s a it’s a valid point. Because I think that there’s there’s these times where we think that we communicate well, and then we go to the other person and it’s like, well, I just thought you knew. But if I communicated well, I wouldn’t have to think what they know. You wouldn’t have to guess. Right. They would they would just tell me, right? So let let’s kind of break this down a little bit, right? You know, a lot of people have heard the different communication styles. Um, that is, I think it’s a common thing that is taught. I don’t think it’s a common thing that’s understood. Um, and so we’re gonna go over the communication styles, right? Like we’ll give that to you. But I want us to take communication maybe a little bit further as we go through these communication styles. Um I’m gonna list them out, all of them, and then we can kind of break them down. Okay. So you have passive, you have passive aggressive, you have aggressive, you have manipulative, and you have assertive, right? I didn’t miss any. No. Okay. Got it. So I always love using um, you know, examples, right? Um, and so whenever I use examples, I like to always, you know, kind of give things that that can make sense. Um and so when we think about what the communication styles are, I’m over here laughing because I’m trying to think of a really good passive thing to say to you, and I don’t even think I can do it because we have such a good relationship where we can be assertive with each other, and so I’m over here like, how can I be passive to Natasha?

SPEAKER_03 3:19
I mean, for me, a lot a lot of times passive for me is you would if if you said something, and even if I didn’t like or agreed with what you said, I’d be like, Okay. I would just be agreeable to you. I mean, for me, when I and I used to be a passive individual, it would just I kind of went along with things. So let’s say you said, um, let’s talk about food. We both love food, and you said, I want donuts. I’m not a donut fan. But in a my passive self would be like, Well, whatever you want, you know, you want donuts? Let’s have donuts. But meanwhile, I’m sitting in my mind going, I don’t like donuts. But I guess, oh well, it doesn’t matter if that’s what she wants. Right?

SPEAKER_04 4:03
Yeah, so you so you would say like in passive, it’s it’s more so of um, you kind of lose yourself in the other person and just go with the flow.

SPEAKER_03 4:10
Sure, just it’s I’m just agreeable. And you know, sometimes I used to chalk it up, but I’m just a simple person, I’m not picky. I don’t, I don’t really care, I don’t have an opinion. And so you give a passive response of, sure, I don’t mind, I don’t care. It is what it is. That’s a passive res that’s a passive reaction or a passive response.

SPEAKER_04 4:29
So I think a lot of times the way I see passive show up um in treatment um is whenever people say it’s you know, it’s whatever you think is best. Yeah. And the whole time in my head, I’m thinking what’s best is for you to stay right there, please. So I can continue sleeping, right? Um, but a lot of us will just say whatever you think is best because we are so fearful of actually saying what we want to say, right? Going back to that episode before when I talked about say what you mean, mean what you say. Don’t say it mean that’s right. Um, and so passive is the is the person that kind of holds their tongue, bites their tongue back, right? All right. So, what would be passive aggressive then?

SPEAKER_03 5:04
Well, I grew up with passive aggressive. Ah, sarcasm. Ooh, I like that one. Lots of I like sarcasm. And for a really long time, it’s something that I learned and adopted as well, where I want to tell you how I’m really thinking or how I’m really feeling, but I don’t really know how you’re going to feel about it and if you’re going to really hear me or understand me. So I’m probably gonna use a little bit of humor or kind of laugh it off, maybe use it in a joke, kind of be joking about it and kidding around with you a little bit. Um, so I can kind of get my message, but at the same time, I don’t want to offend you. So sarcasm was used quite a bit. Um, and to maybe give an example of that. That one’s kind of hard. I don’t know. Ask me to go get donuts. All right. How about we go get donuts?

SPEAKER_04 5:54
Do you really think that’s a good idea? You were just talking about your pants being too tight. Ooh, Laney, woo-wee. I do have to get you back. Anyone who listened to our last episode, Natasha called me up hardcore for eating fried chicken. So I just had to get her back in that one. And she did. And that was a great example of passive aggressive.

SPEAKER_03 6:13
And you’re like, ooh, that one stings just a little bit, and then it just catches you off guard because you’re not. It stings enough to catch you off guard, but it doesn’t sting enough because I didn’t fully say what I meant to say. Correct. And and there’s still some truth to it, right? Because there is truth. Because what you said there was I did talk about needing to lose weight or I needing to get into the gym and you know, taking better care of myself. So there’s truth in that, and I want everybody to make sure you’re hearing that. It’s we’re trying to get the truth out, but it’s the way in which we get the truth out. It’s that tone of voice, you know, it’s that body language, it’s that eye contact. All those things come into play when you’re trying to say something and you’re not quite sure on how to say it. And you say it as such. And you think you’re being a good friend, right? Or a good person by saying that, but meanwhile, the other person just caught what you just said, and I’m like, ooh, that kind of stung just a little bit, right?

SPEAKER_04 7:06
Don’t worry, guys. We love each other and we know that this is all. I mean, I wouldn’t say I’m fun and games because I think this is an important topic, but I would never speak that way to Natasha. I would, you know, you’ll learn about assertiveness here in a minute, and we’ll talk about that. Um, but you know, you saying that makes me think because you know, we had we talked about passive, then this one was passive aggressive. And so now I’m thinking, so aggressive must mean that just mean, mean and yelling. Is that what aggressive is?

SPEAKER_03 7:29
Um aggressive could be physical, it could be verbal, or I could just flat out tell you, no, I don’t want donuts. I don’t, I don’t want what you want. You know, or I could ignore you, right?

SPEAKER_04 7:43
Um I think for me when I think of like aggressive, um, like in that scenario, it’s it’s more so about kind of imposing my values, wants, and needs on you without taking you into consideration.

SPEAKER_03 7:55
You’re taking aggressive to a whole other level, but 100%. You know, like when you said initially, I’m thinking aggressive, like, yeah, are you being loud, are you yelling at me, or just sort of being mean and nasty about something? But that’s that’s really actually a really great point.

SPEAKER_04 8:09
Yeah, so it would be more so this idea of like, you know, your values is to have a healthy lifestyle, my value is to eat what I want to eat, right? Such as donuts, chocolate cake, whatever, right? We can stay on that same um, you know, path of like understanding what this is and what this looks like. Um, but whenever we do, you know, talk about this in an aggressive way, it’s me saying, Well, I don’t really care that you want to eat healthy. If you want to hang out with me, we’re gonna go get donuts.

SPEAKER_03 8:33
And I’ve listened I’ve had people do that with me with substances. You know, they want to go out and drink and I don’t want to drink anymore. And I’ve had people um say those types of things to me, like if you want to hang around us or if you want us to be friends, this is where I’m gonna be at and this is what I’m gonna be doing. And I’m like, okay, and talk about a moment where you really have to really decide what’s more important.

SPEAKER_04 8:55
Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:55
The friends or the recovery. And even if we get the drinking part of it, just right, you know, what’s of more value to me, and definitely my recovery was of more value. So I lost friends as a result, but yeah, I see what you’re saying. That we can we maybe translate that a little bit within families and their loved ones and what that look what that aggressiveness might look like.

SPEAKER_04 9:14
Well, I’ve already got your meeting schedule planned out so that it aligns with when I want to have dinner, and so I want to make sure that you’re available for me. So I went ahead and did that schedule for you. Yikes. I must be really on it today. It’s just like coming off. And you’re really hitting it. Here comes the communication. I think I’m hitting some chords in Natasha. She keeps squirming in her chair. Are you uncomfortable?

SPEAKER_03 9:34
No, but listen, you know, you’re you’re hitting, you’re hitting some pretty important points that I think that a lot of our families, I know that our listeners out there, you’re probably squirming in your chairs as well, uh, like I am, because you’re you’re speaking a lot of truth. These are things that are, like you said earlier when we started this conversation, a lot of us think that that’s good conversation. We think it’s good communication, we think it’s healthy communication because we’re getting it out there. But we’re not even paying attention on how it’s being delivered, right? And we’re not even really looking at are we really being truthful? Like, what’s the intention behind what we’re saying? You know, what’s the motive behind what we’re saying? Right. We just know we want to say something and we say it, right? Without giving it any thought and how that might potentially, you know, might potentially impact the other person. Right.

SPEAKER_04 10:23
So this makes me just kind of based on our conversation, it makes me go to the manipulation one. And this is the one that a lot of times um most people know manipulation, right? And this is what I always hear. Well, yeah, those who struggle with addiction are manipulative. We know that, we hear it, right? I hate to break it to you. You know, families here comes another throw punch. So get ready. All my families out there listening, you also manipulate. If you loved me enough, you would be sober.

SPEAKER_03 10:55
Or if you love me enough now that you’re sober, you wouldn’t be going to that meeting on the night that I want you to do X, Y, and Z. Or do you have to go to that meeting tonight? I want to spend time with you, or you know, you could be doing more to help me around the house.

SPEAKER_04 11:08
I mean, here’s a great one. I got you. I’ve just had a really emotional day, Natasha. Can we please go get donuts? Lord Jesus. If you really love me, you go get donuts with me. If you were a good friend, it’s just been so emotional. I really want donuts.

SPEAKER_03 11:24
All right.

unknown 11:25
All right.

SPEAKER_03 11:26
We’re gonna get her donuts after the show, guys. All right, we’re gonna get her donuts. She’s gonna be super happy about it, even though I don’t want donuts because I can’t afford to have the sugar.

SPEAKER_04 11:35
Right? But this is what a lot of us don’t realize how manipulative we actually are. When we are trying to um essentially, you know, hit a cord another person to get them to do what we want to do, that’s manipulation.

SPEAKER_03 11:45
And I want you to slow that down just a little bit to do what we want them to do. I think that’s really, really important. We want to punctuate, right? We’re we’re we’re we’re communicating to our loved ones and we’re like, no, we don’t manipulate. Yeah, you do when you’re constantly pushing an issue or you’re pushing them to do something the way you want it done. Right. Because you haven’t even stopped to ask what they want. Right. You haven’t stopped to ask, you know, you haven’t stopped to ask me whether or not I wanted donuts or if I would uh prefer another option. Well, I don’t care what you want.

SPEAKER_04 12:17
I know what I want.

SPEAKER_03 12:18
I know what I want, right? What is that? It’s aggressive, aggressive, and now the passive in me is like, okay.

SPEAKER_04 12:26
But that’s you know, but that’s something that you know is important for us to look at. Now we’ve we’ve talked about the ones we don’t want.

SPEAKER_03 12:33
So, what does the one we do want look like? We want to work toward being assertive. And in being assertive with each other, it’s about learning to. I mentioned a couple of things of body language, eye contact. One of the most important things when you’re using your words is speaking from an eye place. We tend to we tend to a lot in communication to use the word you. You did this. Um, well, you don’t want that, but this is what I want, right? And there’s there’s a sort of divide and separation between us in the conversation. There’s a lot of blaming that’s happening in the conversation when you’re using those other styles of communication that you mentioned. But being assertive, I want to learn to speak from an eye place. I want to be able to let you know where I am in this conversation, right? Letting you know how I feel, what I’m thinking, what I’m experiencing. And then you can come back and share with me from your perspective what you’re thinking, what you’re feeling, what you’re experiencing.

SPEAKER_04 13:35
So would you say a part of having assertive communication is also learning how to listen?

SPEAKER_03 13:40
Well, I think that’s number one, absolutely, because if you think about in the other conversations, so if we want to go back to passive really quickly, if you’re doing all the talking, right? And I’m just agreeable, am I really listening to what you have to say? I’m just going along with it. Right? When you made the passive-aggressive comment earlier, immediately it sends a feeling inside of you that you just sort of shut down. So when you’re so caught up in your feelings, when you say I kind of squirmed in my chair, I’m so much more concerned about how I’m feeling. It slows down my ability to really listen and hear what you’re saying, right? When you’re being aggressive, and here comes that tone of voice, here comes that very directness to the individual. Again, the receiving person is in their feelings. Or defensive, right? And or being defensive. And so now I’m just kind of like I’m I’m more focused on what my comeback needs to be, or what I need to do, or whether I need to exit left. I’m thinking more about that, and I’m not actively listening and really hearing what you’re saying. So definitely an assertive, I think that’s the number one thing is we have to learn to listen without trying to um be understood and or needing to explain our side of things. Um, we just need to actively listen to understand what the person is trying to say and not trying to jump in, cut them off, or like you said earlier, being defensive.

SPEAKER_04 15:06
Right. And I think with assertive too, yeah, it does go back to that I place, but it’s, you know, I would really like to go get donuts. I know you’ve been in the gym, so I want to respect what you’re doing. Um, you know, are you open to going to get donuts with me?

SPEAKER_03 15:20
And I really appreciate you asking me. I honestly can’t do the sugar. When I eat sugar, it really, you know, I have a reaction to that. But do you think maybe we can find a place that you can where you can get your donut and maybe I can get something else? And, you know, maybe we can do it that way.

SPEAKER_04 15:37
Beautiful, right? Um, and I think that that’s, you know, we give those examples. And I know, you know, donuts and working out. It’s it’s not as serious as you would say it’s like your loved one struggling with addiction or mental health. But I think it helps us to really see what that assertiveness can look like, right? Absolutely. Um, you know, I always give people, and I’m gonna leave you all, you know, with this little takeaway here with assertiveness, right? Assertiveness is when you can say, I feel blank, and after feel, you have to put a feeling. So if you don’t know what a feeling is, you can Google feeling will, right? So I feel blank, one word when blank, right? What I need is blank.

SPEAKER_03 16:14
Yeah, let’s let’s touch on that before we wrap up. Many people say I feel and they go into this. I feel like, yeah, I feel like, and you go into a monologue or you want to give this entire sentence. I feel is one word. I feel angry, I feel sad, I feel guilty, right? I feel hurt, and it stops there. Not I feel like when you do X, Y, and Z, that’s not a feeling. That’s you just giving your your thoughts about something. Right. So I just wanted to make sure we’re clear on that.

SPEAKER_04 16:45
Absolutely. No, I love it. Um, I do want to, so you know, that I want you all to do the I feel blank when blank. What I need is blank, right? Like that’s what we’re working towards whenever it comes to communication. But one of the last things that I guess I want to close out with this today, right, is is learning how to communicate effectively with your loved one starts with also being willing to open that door. And so for anyone who is listening out there, I would like all of you all, before you even do the homework of the I feel blank when, you know, when blank and I need blank, um, I want you to just ask yourself, is the door even open? Is there a safe space with your loved one to communicate with? And if there isn’t a safe space, that’s okay, right? Do you feel safe sharing your emotions with them? Do they feel safe sharing their emotions with you? And if not, let’s just start by asking questions to understand. Ask them, what can I do to hear you better? You don’t have to say anything, you’re just asking to understand. And if you can do that, those statements will come a lot easier. So that’s what we have for you today. Natasha, do you have anything else?

SPEAKER_03 17:52
No, not at all. I’m I’m one last thing. You talk about that safe space. We have to be willing to put our anger aside to have that conversation. If you’re too angry and you’re too resentful, you’re not you’re not gonna have a healthy conversation with your loved one. So try to either deal with those emotions or put them to the side so that you can have that safe space.

SPEAKER_04 18:14
Good. I love it. All right, you guys, until next time. Till next time, guys.